It is currently Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:02 am

All times are UTC-05:00




Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 5 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: F6F flaps
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 1:04 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed May 31, 2017 2:22 pm
Posts: 76
The flaps are now modelled incorrectly on the F6F series.
While they did have only an 'up' or 'down' setting, the flaps featured an automatic spring system that essentially made them infinitely variable depending on the speed of the aircraft. 50 degrees at 93 kts to 15 degrees at 150 kts. The flaps would retract automatically beyond 170kts and then redeploy as the airspeed fell.(page 13, F6F Pilots Operating handbook)
No idea how this can be modelled, but right now, the all or nothing flaps on the hellcat are a serious drawback for the airplane.
I'll be delighted to email Robert a copy of the POH- but I leave it to more technical types to find a way to give the hellcat back its lower flap settings at 150-170kts.
Thanks
finn


Top
   
 Post subject: Re: F6F flaps
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 7:16 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:48 pm
Posts: 446
We have the F6F manual. As usual it appears the code needs tuned up for the flaps to work that way. Robert has been chewing on the code and has found some things no one knew before, so it's possible the code is there, but hasn't been found yet.

<S>


Top
   
 Post subject: Re: F6F flaps
PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 1:14 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed May 31, 2017 2:22 pm
Posts: 76
May have to find a way to fudge it- sort of like the way we fudged the slats on the LA's and 109's to make up for the code's inability to model them.
Anyhow, not the biggest issue in the game, but 58 degrees of flap is quite a handicap in a dogfight.
finn


Top
   
 Post subject: Re: F6F flaps
PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 5:01 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:54 am
Posts: 698
<S>
Hmm, The flaps of the F6F were never originally designed to be used in combat, pretty much like the Spitfire's flaps. On the other hand very few fighters originally had their flaps design for combat, but pilots learned they could be used to tighten the turn. I've checked through the F6F remodeling thread and below is from the discussion regarding how to model the F6F flaps:

"Flaps limits are reported as 196 mph to lower, 107 mph fully down (170 knots and 93 knots). However the pilot can only select the UP and DOWN positions, and the flaps will set at an angle depending on the airspeed. This is not controllable by the pilot. The game can't really model this though. With this in mind I don't think we should give this FM the option to use combat flaps. I guess we should only give it a single flaps position (50°), and like 160 mph for lowering the flaps to full would be a good compromise? If we set the speed to low then the flaps will to often blowback to UP position while landing. The F6F-5 should have the blowback feature."

"5. Flaps
The POH states blow back flaps 50 degrees at 93 knots, 15 degrees at 150 knots. An airspeed switch prevents flaps being used above 170 knots and will auto retract them above that speed."

"...Since we cannot model this I have only modeled the 50° setting, but at ~160 mph as a trade off so that the flaps won't suddenly blow back to 0° at 107 mph (93 knots) while landing. Also when taking off the pilot could only use 50° flaps, since the speed controlled flaps won't start decreasing in angle until 107 mph (93 knots)
"


The question is wether or not the F6F pilot could use the flaps in combat if he wanted to. Would the complicated mechanism jam by the G-forces from hard turning while having them operable? Or maybe pilots did use them in combat by put them in DOWN position in a turn fight below 196 mph (170 knots). if so we could model them for 10° at 180 mph, 30° at ~150 mph and 50° at 130 mph as a compromise. Considering we later modeled the automatic butterfly flaps of the Japanese N1K1-J to have several selectable flaps stages, since the code doesn't allow for making them automatic, then it could be more fair to also give the F6F the ability to use several flaps angles.


Top
   
 Post subject: Re: F6F flaps
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 2:11 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed May 31, 2017 2:22 pm
Posts: 76
That sounds reasonable Robert. I find the f6F-5 pretty capable as is- but if you can strike this compromise, that would be great- and add some fun I think.
finn


Top
   
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 5 posts ] 

All times are UTC-05:00


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited