:: 109G14

The cooling effect of MW50 allowed "higher boosts" to be used without detonation.
IIRC. The Bf109 could run MW50 for up to 10 mins at a time and had enough water reserves for 20 min total use.

In the same way, 150 grade fuel which the allies used late war in EUROPE worked in the same manner.
The additional cooling effect allowed higher boosts to be used without detonation.

Hence why I think the +18lb boost level on the Spitfire XIV should be re-instated as BST2 (with+ 21lbs as BST3).

If the spitfire xiv was safe to run at +21lbs for 5 mins WEP, it should be good for say 7.5 mins at +18lbs before engine overheats.

If you know anything about how the throttle body worked on a spitfire, you would realise that they were fully automatic.
As you increase the engine REVS with the throttle lever it automatically increases the pre-determined BOOST to match.

UNLIKE many American planes where you had to MANUALLY adjust engine RPM and BOOST!

Author:	Finn [ Thu Aug 01, 2019 6:25 pm ]
Post subject:	109G14
Hey team! What did you guys have for sources for this mark? I've been able to find very little except general stuff lumped in with the other G models. It's a nice ride in WB, but I have no data against which to measure its performance. I must say that overall, I love the remodelled FMs. They all seem to float a bit too much on landing, but other than that I think they're about as close as anyone could get. I remember what an absolute byotch it was to get it right back when I was working with SKYDVR on them. Well done! finn (previously posted in FM forum.)

Author:	grumpy [ Thu Aug 01, 2019 6:38 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 109G14
Thanks Finn. Basically it's slightly heavier than the G6 and it uses the 605AS motor. Somewhat slower lower alts., but better high alt. than the 605A. The larger supercharger eats some power up down low, but that the compromise to get a better higher alt. performance. The parts of the FM that involve speed and climb I believe is about as good as your going to get, but being the modeling of the wing only works properly when flown level. Hence turning and upside down flight is screwed up. Code needs added to address some items, but I doubt anything will be done.

Author:	Finn [ Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:17 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 109G14
grumpy wrote: Thanks Finn. Basically it's slightly heavier than the G6 and it uses the 605AS motor. Somewhat slower lower alts., but better high alt. than the 605A. The larger supercharger eats some power up down low, but that the compromise to get a better higher alt. performance. The parts of the FM that involve speed and climb I believe is about as good as your going to get, but being the modeling of the wing only works properly when flown level. Hence turning and upside down flight is screwed up. Code needs added to address some items, but I doubt anything will be done. I think it might be a bit too fast on the deck, actually, but I don't have any real data on it. It's a fun ride in WB. I'd like to see autorepeat turned off in the game though, so that guys can move the elevator trim so quickly with the K key held down that it spoofs the FM and allows rapid pitch changes that were pretty much impossible at high speed in real life. Yes, 109 pilots used trim. But it was a wheel, and took time to move. Then it had to be moved back to avoid stressing the airframe and wings as they leveled out again. That autorepeat screws with a number of the intended FM outcomes for lots of planes. finn

Author:	Robert [ Fri Aug 02, 2019 7:16 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 109G14
I can ask Spindz if there is a code fix to make the auto-repeat for trim to go slower. The Bf 109G-6 and the Bf 109G-14/ASM are quite identical regarding handling, although the G-14 weighs 414 lb (188 kg) more than the G-6. The Bf-109G-14/ASM used the improved DB 605 ASM engine, whereas the Bf 109G-6 used the DB 605 A-1 engine. The ASM engine was tooled for better high altitude performance. As such at 1.30 ata the Bf 109G-6 is a better performer below 27000 ft, while the G-14 is faster above this altitude. The DB 605 ASM engine however used the MW 50 injektion for WEP, which gave a huge boost to it's WEP both regarding horsepowers and time before the engine would overheat. The DB 605 ASM could be run for 10 minutes at 1.70 ata while the DB 601 A-1 could only operate at 1.42 ata for a minute. As such when using WEP the G-14 is far superior to the G-6 in both speed, climb and turn rate (much better power/weight ratio) at all altitudes. From my tests the G-14 should hit the correct numbers for speed/climb etc compared to historical data. Below is the BHP build for both the engines. As can be seen the ASM has a better WEP power output, while the A-1 is stronger at the normal "kampfleistung 1.30 ata" rating up to 27000 ft. I'll also include speed and climb diagrams from my tests. I've included the Spitfire XIVe and Spitfire LF XIe for comparison. Do note that the G-6 can only hold this max speed for one minute, and as such the Spitfire LF IXe is generally faster than the G-6, while the G-14 will out run the Spitfire LF XIe. The Spitfire XIVe is vastly superior to both Bf 109's speed wise. <S> /Robert

Author:	nookyb [ Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:57 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 109G14
nice job robert.

http://bhlanding.ient.com/warbirdsforum/

109G14 http://bhlanding.ient.com/warbirdsforum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=623	Page 1 of 4

Author:	bollok [ Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:15 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 109G14
The cooling effect of MW50 allowed "higher boosts" to be used without detonation. IIRC. The Bf109 could run MW50 for up to 10 mins at a time and had enough water reserves for 20 min total use. In the same way, 150 grade fuel which the allies used late war in EUROPE worked in the same manner. The additional cooling effect allowed higher boosts to be used without detonation. Hence why I think the +18lb boost level on the Spitfire XIV should be re-instated as BST2 (with+ 21lbs as BST3). If the spitfire xiv was safe to run at +21lbs for 5 mins WEP, it should be good for say 7.5 mins at +18lbs before engine overheats. If you know anything about how the throttle body worked on a spitfire, you would realise that they were fully automatic. As you increase the engine REVS with the throttle lever it automatically increases the pre-determined BOOST to match. UNLIKE many American planes where you had to MANUALLY adjust engine RPM and BOOST!

Author:	-fess- [ Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:50 am ]
Post subject:	Re: 109G14
bollok wrote: The cooling effect of MW50 allowed "higher boosts" to be used without detonation. IIRC. The Bf109 could run MW50 for up to 10 mins at a time and had enough water reserves for 20 min total use. In the same way, 150 grade fuel which the allies used late war in EUROPE worked in the same manner. The additional cooling effect allowed higher boosts to be used without detonation. Hence why I think the +18lb boost level on the Spitfire XIV should be re-instated as BST2 (with+ 21lbs as BST3). If the spitfire xiv was safe to run at +21lbs for 5 mins WEP, it should be good for say 7.5 mins at +18lbs before engine overheats. If you know anything about how the throttle body worked on a spitfire, you would realise that they were fully automatic. As you increase the engine REVS with the throttle lever it automatically increases the pre-determined BOOST to match. UNLIKE many American planes where you had to MANUALLY adjust engine RPM and BOOST! the extensiveness of you guyses knowledge is incredible. Have you read absolutely every article ever written on ww2 aircraft? I mean how would you even know all that.

Author:	Pakrat [ Fri Aug 02, 2019 1:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 109G14
Please dont mess with the trim autorepeat. It has already been desensitized and any more would severely alter the way many pilots fly. Leave it alone!

Author:	-splt- [ Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 109G14
Turn auto repeat off. You can bang on the proper key or switch fast enough one step at a time and still be too fast in some airframes I would think.

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